Kreg jig settings for lattice around a deck

[Jack Haskins, Jr.]

I am redoing my deck around the pool and want to put lattice up. I have 4x4 posts vertical. I want to attach the lattice to one side of the 4x4 with screws. Then I want to cap that with 1x4's. I want to use the jig to create pocket holes on both sides of the 4x4's so the screws will go through the 4x4 (from the sides) and into the 1x4's that are covering the area where the lattice sections meet and the screws that are holding the lattice to the 4x4. This way all I should see is the wood covering the lattice with no screws showing (unless you look behind the lattice. If anyone wants to do that they can see all the holes they want to. lol

I hope that made sense.

Anyway, I will be putting pocket holes in the side of a 4x4 (3 1/2" actual) and screwing into a 1x4 (3/4" actual). The lattice is 1/8" thick.  That should be like using 7/8" thick wood (the 1x4) instead of an actual 3/4" thick. So adding the lattice between the 4x4 and 1x4 would allow drilling just a bit deeper pocket hole than the charts say. Or, using just a bit longer screw.

I re-read what I typed and got confused. And I know what I want to do. So I decided to provide a picture of the lattice and 1x4 against the 4x4. The pocket holes will be drilled on the side of the 4x4 behind the lattice so the screws that hold the 1x4 against the lattice will not show. The 1x4 will hide the screws holding the lattice to the 4x4.

Any suggestions on the jig and bit collar settings?  Thanks in advance for any help.

Jack

PS

After looking at the picture I may put wooden plugs in the pocket holes on the 4x4 prior to painting.

[Ken Darga]

Why can't you fasten the lattice fencing to the 4x4 and then apply the 1x strips over the fencing?

[mathew patton]

3 7/8" from step of drill bit to stop, set kreg jig mini 1 3/16 from edge of post. use 2 1/2" screw.

[Jack Haskins, Jr.]

Ken, that is what I want to do. The 1x4 will cover where two pieces of lattice come together and the screws that hold the lattice to the 4x4. The 4x4's are 8' apart and the lattice is 4'x8'. My goal is not to have any screw holes in the 1x4. I'm going to paint the whole thing so I could use putty to cover the screw holes that would be visible from inside the deck. But having the new jig I want to use it. At first I was considering not covering the pocket holes as they will be behind the lattice and not as visible. But I may plug them anyway. I got a bag of wooden ones in the master system. I used a few on another project and I like how they look. BUT, sanding them smooth on the 4x4's will be a bit awkward. I used a belt sander to smooth the others I used but that was on a flat surface. These will be on a vertical surface and the sander may be awkward to use. I could trim them down a lot with a knife or chisel I suppose. We'll see. Learning is one reason I want to use the jig. It's a great tool and using it often in as many different type projects as I can will give me experience with it.

Thanks Mathew for the picture.  I have the regular and the mini jig both but hadn't considered using the mini. Why do you suggest that one over the regular (blue) jig?

Thanks guys.

Jack

PS

Does anyone have tips on finishing after using the wooden pocket hole plugs?

[Ken Darga]

Jack,

The hole plugs can be cut nearly flush, with the surrounding surface, using a flush-cut fine tooth saw.

3x5 file card stock can be used as a spacer, around the plug when cutting.

The file card stock will also protect the surface, from the inadvertent rubbing of the saw teeth on the surface, and the potential of scratching it.

Sand the protruding plug flush with an ROS.

NOTE:  plugging the pocket holes will prevent spiders, and other critters, from building nests in the holes.

How is the long span of the 4x 8 ft lattice fence being supported, between the posts and rails?

I've installed many 4x8 ft sheets lattice fencing, on several exterior projects.

The panels need to be supported so as to prevent sagging and distortion. 

FYI

In freezing climate regions, the lattice panels will crack, if firmly affixed to the wood.

The wood will move---the plastic won't move at the same rate.

When I've installed these panels, I drill 5/16" holes in the panels, and use a #8-10 washer head screws---

install the screws so they just touch the material---DO NOT snug-up or tighten the screws---so as to allow the panels to move/slide as the wood moves.

[Jack Haskins, Jr.]

Thanks Ken,

 

Just went and bought a flush-cut saw at Lowe's. 

 

The lattice will be laid on it's 8' side making the rails approx. 4' tall. I plan on using a 2x4 or maybe a 1x4 along the top, behind the lattice with the same type 1x4 board capping the screws. The boards along the top of the lattice will be anchored to the 4x4s at each end.  Something like that. Also something to anchor the lattice at the bottom. As you can see not a lot of experience nor thought going on here. I want the end result to look pretty good but I only want to spend what I need to to make it safe and look pretty decent.  I've looked at some of the stuff you can get to make a pool deck look really nice but we don't need that. In fact while at Lowe's today I looked at some 4' tall and 8' tall vinyl deck posts. I don't want them for the fence around the deck. I may use them to hold up a 30" square mini-deck that will be above the water. The stairs into the pool will attach to that. I will also need to anchor the mini-deck to the deck around the pool. I need support for the mini-deck that can stay in the water.  Any tips or ideas on suspending a 30x30" deck above water?  I'm sort of piecing all this stuff together as I go. But depending on how deep the exact measurements are I may need to get 2 4' tall, or if the water is too deep (I think it is) I'll need to get two 8' tall posts and cut them down.  I'm rambling. Sorry.

 

I am wondering about how to put the mini-deck together. Any suggestions here are appreciated.  It will be above the water with vertical supports and also attach to the deck. On one side will be the stairs into the water. On the other side will be a railing. On the side facing the water is where the plank will go for throwing prople in. lol No rail there. This is an above ground pool 4' deep. The center is dug out an additional 2' deep so we can dive in. Jumping off the mini-deck will be taking place. The deck around the pool is about 3" lower than the top of the pool wall.  I've already replaced all the top boards of the deck outside the pool and the stairs and will be adding a little more as well. And a new changing room. It's been a lot of work and fun too. My son and another friend have helped a lot. Anyway, I think I want the top boards of the small deck to be supported NOT the side boards around them. I'm thinking make a 30" square (like a picture frame) with the boards laying flat (2x6’s). The vertical posts will support that.  Then the boards we actually walk on will lay on top of that square. Then some boards just to make it look better will to around the side of that thing. All I have to go on is some experience with measuring, cutting, screwing wood together to make something, etc. I don't know anything really about decks or decks suspended above water. This is my first suspended deck. The deck does need to support me and I've gained weight in the past few years. What's that??? Call a bridge builder??  lol

I live on the panhandle of FL so not much freezing goes on here. Still I will drill holes in the lattice for the screws. A few places on the other lattice that was there (before some hurricane) I noticed had cracked at the screw head. I don't now if the cracks were from the lattice contracting over time or a couple of hurricanes.  About 3 times a year early in the morning there's some ice on the ground. So it gets below freezing on a few nights in the winter. We tie our dog out every morning and I've wondered if he licked his frozen water would his tongue stick?  Don't really want to find out if it would though. lol Still rambling.

 

Jack

Ken Darga said:

Jack,

The hole plugs can be cut nearly flush, with the surrounding surface, using a flush-cut fine tooth saw.

3x5 file card stock can be used as a spacer, around the plug when cutting.

The file card stock will also protect the surface, from the inadvertent rubbing of the saw teeth on the surface, and the potential of scratching it.

Sand the protruding plug flush with an ROS.

 

NOTE:  plugging the pocket holes will prevent spiders, and other critters, from building nests in the holes.

 

How is the long span of the 4x 8 ft lattice fence being supported, between the posts and rails?

I've installed many 4x8 ft sheets lattice fencing, on several exterior projects.

The panels need to be supported so as to prevent sagging and distortion. 

 

FYI

In freezing climate regions, the lattice panels will crack, if firmly affixed to the wood.

The wood will move---the plastic won't move at the same rate.

When I've installed these panels, I drill 5/16" holes in the panels, and use a #8-10 washer head screws---

install the screws so they just touch the material---DO NOT snug-up or tighten the screws---so as to allow the panels to move/slide as the wood moves.

 

[Ken Darga]

Jack,

I think it would be a good idea, to consult with your community area center, such as city or village hall, and obtain pool and deck construction criteria requirements.

Also, there are some good reference books on deck building.

They can be obtained from your local library, book store, or builder supply center.

[Keith]

Jack, just an fyi that the type of lattice you are working with will expand and contract substantially if it is in sunlight and secured tightly. So, if it's installed securely, it will bow during the day. When I install this type of lattice, I let it float. Consider dowels and Ken Darga's advice. Insert the dowel through the face of the 1x4 through a lattice square hole. Let the lattice float on the dowel. If the dowels are spaced correctly, it should look very nice.

[Jack Haskins, Jr.]

Ken and Keith,

I like the idea of the lattice hanging on dowels to allow for maximum movement due to heat or cold. But I’m thinking I’ll need to drill holes in the lattice for the dowel. The end of each piece of  lattice should fit somewhere in the center of each 4x4 so I don’t think there will be a hole in the lattice on the 4x4 surface for a dowel. If not I can drill a hole large enough for a dowel and allow for movement. But I’m also thinking since the 1x4’s will cover all this why can’t I drill a large hole in the lattice and use a screw to hold the lattice up instead of a dowel. Then the 1x4 will lay flat on top of the screw heads keeping the lattice between the 4x4 and 1x4 without any pressure on the lattice. That should allow for movement and keep the lattice in place. And using screws instead of dowels will make the job easier and faster. But, if there is anything wrong with me using screws  instead of dowels that I’m not thinking of, please let me know. Easier and faster is good as long as it doesn’t result in a poor job.

 

 Thanks guys.

Jack

[Paul Clipsham]

Jack

Just a idea. Over here in Australia, and I should think in the US we enclose lattice in timber. On the inside of the frame is a rabbet which is deep enough to allow the lattice to expand and contract. The you fig the frame to the posts. That way you will have your handrail and also have the lattice look also.

[Jack Haskins, Jr.]

Paul Clipsham said:

Jack

Just a idea. Over here in Australia, and I should think in the US we enclose lattice in timber. On the inside of the frame is a rabbet which is deep enough to allow the lattice to expand and contract. The you fig the frame to the posts. That way you will have your handrail and also have the lattice look also.

[Jack Haskins, Jr.]

Oops, computer had a brain fart and forgot my post above. I tend to blame computers and tools for my mistakes. :)

Paul, I like that idea along with the one about using dowels. In my previous attempt to post I explained in detail why I decided to go a different way but I haven't the energy to retype everything. Anyway, what I did was drill a hole much bigger than the screw diameter to allow for expansion. I left the screw head about 1/4" from the surface of the wood. The lattice is 1/8" thick. The screws were around the outside of what is a 3-1/2" frame for each piece of lattice (2x4 or 4x4). So I added some "spacer" screws around the inside of the boards to keep my 1x4 boards from clamping down on the lattice. They will be attached using pocket holes from the back side of the lattice so there won't be any screw heads showing on the fence. Not from the inside of the deck that is. I decided to go ahead and use wood plugs to hide the pocket holes. Such a small task that should make a difference in appearance for years to come. I'm going to paint everything but something tells me empty pocket holes on a painted fence will stick out like a sore thumb. Even if I'm the only one to notice them. Also I don't want someone who knows a lot about wood working or decks to say something like "That's a pretty nice deck. WHY DIDN'T YOU PLUG UP YOUR POCKET HOLES???!"  lol

The last step in the lattice fence portion will be to put a 1x6 laying flat on top of the 4x4 posts and 2x4 rails to cover up the top of the boards and lattice as well as provide a flat area for drinks and such.

The other things I need to do are build  a small (6' x 8') changing/storage room and install a set of stairs. The stairs will be cool. I made a mini-deck and will attach it to the top of the deck on the outside of the pool. It will extend over the water by about 30". I'll attach stairs (not a ladder) to the side of the mini-deck so you would be walking down along the side of the pool. The front of the deck you can jump off of. The water you jump into is 6' deep right there. I may put a regular ladder on the other side of the deck just to have it there. I already have the ladder. 

Jack