I would like an opinion on this

[Rosemarie Wood]

I am going to make a kitchen work area, it will be a basic 4 foot plus(?) high cabinet about 5 feet long and about 18" more or less deep, I want to tile the top so I can use it like a counter to place my every day appliances and prepare food.

My question:  I am not crazy about making a face frame but I would if I have to, ok,

On one if it Kreg's videos they say if you want to make wide items then jig 6" boards together.

Do you think it is better all the way around if I do that or I get Cabinet grade ply wood and have it cut to 18" wide strips, but they may not cut them evenly, (I cannot cut them myself

because of the weight issue)  I do have a table saw for smaller cuts, or is it just as easy to lay them side by side and use the 6" strips and pocket hole them together.  I usually make my shelves and small cabinets with the standard widths and I am fine.

Thanks for any help deciding, Happy Thanksgiving

Ro

[Rosemarie Wood]

Thanks so much Doug, I had planned to make a back board using something like wainscotting to hold it stable, not unlike the way they do on entertainment centers.  I am making an old fashioned 1940's kitchen that would look nice all in white.

I am also going to add vertical posts to keep it from sagging in the middle so it will hold the tile top, the tile is not a absolute yet, just a thought since I have enough on hand.

So I think I got the stabilizing covered.   I will check out the "sagulator" it sounds interesting. 

I am not used to making things so refined, I have made many shelving units in my sewing/spare room that no one will see and a large Chicken coop for my girls, but that actually came out nice, it is strong enough so that I could move in with them.

You have a Great Thanksgiving also,

Ro

Douglas Harwood said:

Happy Thanksgiving Rosemarie,

Hopefully you can get Jay to jump in here, but I'm going to post a link for you below called the

"Sagulator".  This handy little calculator will help you in calculating loads and dimensions and has

been developed by engineers.  It has saved my butt on several occasions.  When you use a tile top,

which looks great, you are really putting a heavy load on your structure.

 

As for building face frames, they are all made pretty much the same way.  Think of stiles(vertical) and

rails(horizontal, like a train track).  These help more to keep your cabinet or shelf from racking(moving

side to side) but will not do so much for a vertical load.  Send a message to Jay Boutwell on this blog, he

is a professional cabinet maker and probably would be kind enough to shoot you some plans.

 

Regards,

Doug

 

www.woodbin.com/calcs/sagulator.htm

 

[Jens Jensen]

Im not to clear on why you want to use cabinet grade ply when your covering with tile. Kind of pricy I would say If your worried about sagging double up on 18 and put two layers on,and edge band the perimeter.Add your legs and start tiling.

[Jens Jensen]

Here are some pictures of a table I did for us 10 yrs ago It is 48 x60 ,Notice there is no support under it and legs are applied to skirt/add edge banding and tile it  and you are ready to slice turkey

[Rosemarie Wood]

That is why I am asking, I thought it might be more expensive, but Kreg recommends it on one of their videos, also I was not looking forward to making a face frame. I have done it but it is a pain to me, I am not covering the entire cabinet with tile just the top, there is the sides and shelves, but I will be painting the entire surface since my kitchen is all white. That is telling me too that the cabinet grade is not needed.

I really originally thought it best to use regular wood.  Your table is beautiful, I will have plenty of support for the tile and the items I want to use it for thaqt was not my problem.  I am in favor of using real wood and I always use it except for my coop. All my cabinets are real wood but mostly I make them just wide enough I never made one that is 18" deep.

I just didn't want to make it and then hear from someone that I should have used the cabinet grade ply wood.

Now I will be putting my Kreg Jig to good use, again.

Thanks so much for taking the time to answer my question.

Ro

Do you have a pic of the top?  I would love to see how you finished it.

 

Jens Jensen said:

Im not to clear on why you want to use cabinet grade ply when your covering with tile. Kind of pricy I would say If your worried about sagging double up on 18 and put two layers on,and edge band the perimeter.Add your legs and start tiling.

[Jens Jensen]

The Maple slab is a old slab I had laying around and was 13 inches wide so I ended up splitting an made a wall shelf,Also did a coffee table same way

[Jay Boutwell]

Hi Rosemarie, I would be more thatn happy to assist you with building a cabinet however I do need to know some details about what you wish the cabinet to look like and its functions.

Details like: Does it sit against a wall or is it set so it will be seen on more that one side, like the front and the ends?   Does it sit so that it adjoins another cabinet?  Do you wish compartments inside the cabinet and if so how many ? (I would suggest at least one due to its length.)  Do You wish to have drawers in it?  It this a paint grade or will it be stained?  Since it is a 1940 error style most have bead board material in them.  If you desire beadboard material can be used as a back or cabinet ends that are exposed.  I would suggest you build it in the same style as your current cabinets unless you intend to use the cabinet as an accent.  Perhaps a photo or two posted of the exhisting style would help.  On items such as doors and drawers are they overlay on a face frame or do the sit inside a face frame. Need to have idea as to type of doors you wish.  Need to know the finished height of the cabinet top as the 4 foot height mentioned in your post is too high for a work surface.  I suggest 36 inches which is standard and it you wish to use the top to make pastery or such where you may need ot roll out dough it should be a couple inches lower.  I understand that you intend to use tile as a finished surface.  If you are going to use it for pastery I would suggest a piece of granite as you do not have to deal with the grout problems you will face.  As a suggestion, You might visit some of the counter top fabricators in your area and see if they have a remant of which many will give it to you as it costly to dispose of it.  You could set it into place as long as it is square without having the edge finished and use wood self edge.  I do this quite often for customers and it is a highly desired item.  If it for just meat cutting then a butcher block top would be my suggestion and you could even build this yourself.   This is things you need to consider and determine before the build takes place as you have to make you cabinet parts to fit the final cabinets sizes. 

Another thing to consider is the toe kicks.  Failure to build toe kicks will definately ruin your desire for food and it always happens when you will bash your toes into the cabinet.  Consider the height of the toe kick as well as there is nothing more painful as scraping the top of your foot under the toe kick that is too low.  It can also be hazzard and cause you to fall as you walk away and the foot is caught under the toe kick.

As far the building this is one that can be built with ease and can be built out of plywood and solid stock and trimmed out with bead board or other choices you may have.  For the most part it can be build with the kreg jig and glue.

If you so desire I would be happy to assist you with a plan that I could draw for you.  I never use plans so I have none to send you at the moment.   At least this will give you an idea as to what information you need to begin. 

[Rosemarie Wood]

Thanks so much for sending the pic of your beautiful table I love the finish, it looks professional.

I also love having wood "slices" around I have one that was made for me with my nickname, Lady etched in the front.  Beautiful job on the wall shelves too.  That is very inventive, I just love the way some people's minds work you just see something and use it to create objects of beauty, wonderful.

Thanks

Ro

Jens Jensen said:

The Maple slab is a old slab I had laying around and was 13 inches wide so I ended up splitting an made a wall shelf,Also did a coffee table same way

[Rosemarie Wood]

Well Jay, what can I say I very much appreciate all the trouble you went through to assist me.

I do have everything covered. But some of your comments help I will keep everything in mind. I am like you there will be no plans.  I too never use a plan, I never used patterns when making clothes either they confuse me more.  I guess we both have great minds :)  Seriously I did make toe kicks when I am making anything I am going to stand up next to since I am a bit cljumsy.

Also, I am sorry I wrote the wrong height, I want one about the heigh of my existing counter which is 3 Feet you are right 4 is too high, but I have to make it that tall since I have a bad back and cannot lean over touch, and not I no longer make pies, not a very healthy thing to have due to all the fat.  I just need it to keep my Vitamix on and use, there really will not be any actual food on it except for ocassionally holding an apple or two for my Green smoothies.  I do not eat meat so it will not get contaminated that way.  I will grout it in a dark color like my counter and I will seal it.

I am making compartments to act as "braces" to hold the unit together.  It will be up against the wall with the front and both sides showing.

Here is my first big project I made when I moved  into this house, just to show you I know how to make things this coop can actually hold upwards of 15 hens. It now has a real roof, I did nort back then, I cojld not decide what kind I wanted, I was in a hurry since the little ones were growing fast and I had to get them out of the house. I did this myself with no help at all.  I am not a youngster so I am very proud of this.  I think if I can do this and all the cabinets in my sewing room I can make a simple cabinet.

I really appreciate your offer to help but I am now only in the planning stage.  I have the Wainscotting here and it is a half sheet and will look great behind this unit.  I figure that will help stable it a bit.

The main purpose is for me to keep my many small appliances that are now taking up all the room on the small counter and shoved into the cabinets below leaving me no space to work.   I will be setting up some open shelving on the immediate wall above the unit.  These shelves will be holding some of my canned goods and extra glassware etc.

Thanks again I do appreciate your help.Ro

 

Jay Boutwell said:

Hi Rosemarie, I would be more thatn happy to assist you with building a cabinet however I do need to know some details about what you wish the cabinet to look like and its functions.

Details like: Does it sit against a wall or is it set so it will be seen on more that one side, like the front and the ends?   Does it sit so that it adjoins another cabinet?  Do you wish compartments inside the cabinet and if so how many ? (I would suggest at least one due to its length.)  Do You wish to have drawers in it?  It this a paint grade or will it be stained?  Since it is a 1940 error style most have bead board material in them.  If you desire beadboard material can be used as a back or cabinet ends that are exposed.  I would suggest you build it in the same style as your current cabinets unless you intend to use the cabinet as an accent.  Perhaps a photo or two posted of the exhisting style would help.  On items such as doors and drawers are they overlay on a face frame or do the sit inside a face frame. Need to have idea as to type of doors you wish.  Need to know the finished height of the cabinet top as the 4 foot height mentioned in your post is too high for a work surface.  I suggest 36 inches which is standard and it you wish to use the top to make pastery or such where you may need ot roll out dough it should be a couple inches lower.  I understand that you intend to use tile as a finished surface.  If you are going to use it for pastery I would suggest a piece of granite as you do not have to deal with the grout problems you will face.  As a suggestion, You might visit some of the counter top fabricators in your area and see if they have a remant of which many will give it to you as it costly to dispose of it.  You could set it into place as long as it is square without having the edge finished and use wood self edge.  I do this quite often for customers and it is a highly desired item.  If it for just meat cutting then a butcher block top would be my suggestion and you could even build this yourself.   This is things you need to consider and determine before the build takes place as you have to make you cabinet parts to fit the final cabinets sizes. 

Another thing to consider is the toe kicks.  Failure to build toe kicks will definately ruin your desire for food and it always happens when you will bash your toes into the cabinet.  Consider the height of the toe kick as well as there is nothing more painful as scraping the top of your foot under the toe kick that is too low.  It can also be hazzard and cause you to fall as you walk away and the foot is caught under the toe kick.

As far the building this is one that can be built with ease and can be built out of plywood and solid stock and trimmed out with bead board or other choices you may have.  For the most part it can be build with the kreg jig and glue.

If you so desire I would be happy to assist you with a plan that I could draw for you.  I never use plans so I have none to send you at the moment.   At least this will give you an idea as to what information you need to begin.