What is the best way to square a Frame?

[Larry Mathews]

I am making an 75" x 40" frame with 2X4s and want each corner square.  Now  if I was using nails I would place one in each joint then measure the diagnols and square it up before putting more nails in the joint.  The Kreg system will pull the joint tight.  So what is the best way to square this frame using the Kreg system to join the 2X4s at right angles?

[John Schaben]

Theoretically, if your cuts are dead bang it should self square. 

[Larry Mathews]

John, that is no doubt the BEST way.  So maybe I should have asked "What is a good way?"  I am using a circular saw and although my cuts are good, they are not dead bang on and my treated lumber is not exactly straight.  So is there another way to assure the frame comes out square?

[John Schaben]

I think, in this case, "a good way" would to be work on your cut accuracy. Using the pocket jig isn't the only operation where a square cut is necessary. Rig or make a jig to guide your saw. I think Kreg makes a tool for that, "square cut (?)" maybe. Not necessary to by one, very easy to make and can be made for any angle you want. I'm on my way to work but if you google "circular saw guides" it should come up with something. Or, go to amazon or the Kreg website and go through the Kreg products. It's just a device that you can hold against the work piece and it provides a square reference for you to guide your saw against.

[Larry Mathews]

Thanks John for the suggestion.  Clearly square cuts are very important just as getting the right lengths are.  I will work on my accuracy and maybe that is the only way to square up a frame if one is using the pocket hole technique.  I was hoping there was another way in the case where the cut is a little off.  For example what if I only joined each joint with one screw and did not pull it tight.   Then couldn't I check the square just like I would if I was not using pocket holes, or would the frame just move when I went back and added the second screw and pulled the screws tight?

[John Schaben]

Hi Larry - you could square it up by playing with the screw tension but you would be sacrificing joint tightness. You would also need to make sure your design had plenty of redundant bracing to ensure rigidity and I don't think glue would be optional. You may also be able to "cheat" a bit with shims. To follow your thoughts, put the first screw in the tight side and make sure it is tight. Square it up and shim the "loose" edge and put in the second screw tightly. Trim the shim leaving part in the joint.

[Ed L]

Larry, you could also clamp a square to the inside corner and use that to set the adjacent 2x6. If your left witha big gap, use shims and glue. Once you have your gaps filled, hammer or screw to secure. It won't be pretty unless you plan to fill, sand and paint. 

Larry Mathews said:

Thanks John for the suggestion.  Clearly square cuts are very important just as getting the right lengths are.  I will work on my accuracy and maybe that is the only way to square up a frame if one is using the pocket hole technique.  I was hoping there was another way in the case where the cut is a little off.  For example what if I only joined each joint with one screw and did not pull it tight.   Then couldn't I check the square just like I would if I was not using pocket holes, or would the frame just move when I went back and added the second screw and pulled the screws tight?

[Larry Mathews]

Thanks guys.  Both of these suggestions are very helpful.  I am trying to be very careful with my cuts, but I appreciate having fallback options in case I am a little off.  As you may have guessed since I am using 2X4s looks are not as important in this case as function.  I am actually building a door in a privacy fence on a deck -- so we are not talking about finish cabinet work

[Jens Jensen]

Pull diagonals

[Larry Mathews]

Jens, That is what I had in mind when I posted the original question.  I did not know if that would work with the Kreg jig.

[Jens Jensen]

Like others said if all cuts are dead on thee should be no reason that it has to be squared.Two 45'sare a  90 but a 44 and 44  are you no what TROUBLE.I wonder if band clamps might work just for pulling in right angles

[Jay Boutwell]

Something not yet mentioned here is using the  "3-4-5" method.  When laying out a floor plan or a foundation of a building it is often the quickest method to determine if a corner is square. It works on checking the square of any object as well.  In use measure down one leg of the object to be squared a distance of 3 feet and mark it. Measure a distance of 4 feet on the other leg and mark it.  It the object is square it will be exactly 5 feet across the distance of the two marks on each leg.  This only tells you that this one corner is square.  The easiest method to check the 4 sides is to run measurments on a diagonals across the frame and compare the resulsts. It is square if they are the same. 

[Larry Mathews]

Jay & Jens,  I have used the diagonal method before with one nail in each corner until I got it square. In that case as long as it is not finish work if my cut was off a 16th it did not matter.  With using the pocket holes it seems to me the screws will pull it back out of alignment if the cuts are not dead on.  John's suggestion of using shims might solve that problem.  What do you think?  Of course as we all know the real answer is square cuts.