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Disaster has struck my Inlay Table Jun 2011 and 4 Veneer table top all in 1 day

Can you beleive it!

 

I was on my third finishing coat on the table top and next morning I found the surface finish resembled sandpaper, more unlisted dictonary words were used, but the surface didnt change.

 

I was so annoyed I left it to work on something different, I started staining my 4 veneer table top as I had made a base for it, actually the work was inspired by Jay Boutwell's comments.

I used Wattyl "Jarrah" stain, applied it all around and left it to dry, in the afternoon I checked how it looked, and it looked dreadfull, blotchy patches everywhere, so I removed it with fine steel wool right back to the bare Tasmanian Blackwood, thinking it was contaminated with glue/filler or some othere residue then  stained it again.

Same result. (arr mumble mumble)

 

So deciding it was possibly the Jarrah stain and the Bondall Interior exerior clear gloss I was using being old so off I went to the local Paint shop, taking my Inlay table top and empty cans with me.

After looking at it and sanding a small area

His recommendations were,

1 Use a mohair roller instead of a brush, and he showed me a sample result, amazing finish.

2 Use   Resene Qristal Clear polyurethane or Wattyl Estapol Flooring 2 Pack polyurethane, not Bondall products.

3 Use tack cloth after sanding to remove all possible residue and consider filtering the polyurethane via a stocking before applying.

4 Find a dust free area to allow it to dry.

 

So $100 bucks plus later I will try again, I had never considered using a roller, does anybody else use themto apply clear finishes?

 

Robert Brennan

 

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Hi Robert, Sorry to read about the disasterous results of your finish.  Seems like every once in a while things just don't go as they should, where it is from the woodworker's error or some hokey pokey new produce that of course is the worlds best thing going until you use it and find out differently.  I have found that the most suscess is found when you develope your own method and stick to it.  Over many times of applying your own method, you become very good at it and in the course of time have figured out the remedy to get a great finish.   You learn the tricks of what and how much stain and finish to apply and the best methods to do so.  When you come to veneer you are challenged as there is only so many times you can sand before the veneer becomes "no veneer".  Often the problems is simple like trying to apply the finish too fast and or too  heavy and not allowing the finish time to dry. 

I never have used a roller to apply finish or even stain for that matter unless I am staining a deck or siding on a house.  To me it would be like using a tar mop to apply a fine automotive finish on your fine automobile.  I will either spray the finish after I had apply and rubbed the stains out, or I will use either foam brush or a very high quality brush.  I am a believer in this simple fact, that not the same method or products work the same for everyone.  They all differ and this is again the thing that makes you and your work different and unique from those of the other woodworker. 

 I hope you can get it to work out for you and please do post a picture or two of the problem pieces and maybe some one on the community will have an idea as to the cause of the problem.  Look at it this way, the finish failure is really an  education and when you figure it out, and I know you will, you will educated in what and why it happened.

Later Robert

I agree with Jay's comments on finish application and building a technique based on your own experience.

 

My approach to veneer is to never sand; I always use a scraper or a finely tuned low angle block plane.  Not only will sanding fill the pores with sanding dust, the wood fibers get crushed and cause fuzzy nubs under some finishes. 

Second - never use a tack cloth.  At least never use a commercial tack cloth.  Use a cloth soaked in the solvent of your finish.  That way your cloth doesn't leave anything behind that isn't incompatible with the finish.

 

Third - if you must sand, don't over sand.  Use a sanding block so your pressure is even and you don't round over edges.  I never go higher than 400 grit on solid wood.  Flatten the finish, not the wood.

 

Dust free work area is a must.  Make a finishing booth out of cardboard on at least three sides and a top.  Put a box fan into the back wall of the booth and strap a furnace filter on the intake side.  Blow the air out the back.  The idea is to keep air moving, pulling any dust in the air away from your project.

 

Finally - old finishes can't be saved.  Don't save them.  Recycle or dispose of them in a legal and environmentally safe way.  I've never used the finishes you mention in your post, but I'm not sure the poly products you mention are even a third choice for most woodworkers.  Visit your local Woodcraft store to talk to them about compatible stains and top coats.  Flexner's book on understanding finishing and finishes is a great resource and should be on your self.

 

Good luck!

 

Mark

Hello Mark,

 

Your comments make interesting reading and will give me some follow up actions as well,

Thanks.

 

For general interest the following has happened

 

I have some a set of Bahco scrapers so I will be giving them a run on the veneer, they were usually only used to remove glue residue up to now, however I guess by default they were also used to finish the work so that will be advanced.

 

I have a air compressor to blow out sanding residue however its needed to be used with care on veneer as I am always concerned  that it will get under the veneer and do damage, so I use my industrial vacuum in most of the work.

The tack cloth,

I tried it but like yourself I didnt get a good feeling from it as it made my hands sticky and therfore also making  the surface sticky of which I didnt like the feel of.

I have never seen these items in a dedicated wood working store.

 so I will be doing some research on them.

I know there  was mention of them in my "Finishing Basics" by Sam Allen and in particular warning against using shop made tack cloths, so the reference you provided will give me an area to do some more research on so I can make a more informed opinion and learn more details of the Pros and Cons.

As for over sanding I can only agree, I had first hand experience of this with my latest project "Rockys domino Box" where the store bought inlay I used had the side sanded too much.

Dust free work area.

I have erected our capming kitchen Gazebo  as a temporary measure in the yard and have the table tops in there as we speak.

It was done as a last resort and from the result of the overnight damage done in the garage uncovered.

 

I like the idea of having a ventelated cardboard box and will persue that avenue also.

 

In closing, all the advice I have received I would never have considered and appreciate the input this forum provides.

 

Kerg Tool you are on a winner there never change.

 

Regards

Robert Brennan
Mark Ferraro said:

I agree with Jay's comments on finish application and building a technique based on your own experience.

 

My approach to veneer is to never sand; I always use a scraper or a finely tuned low angle block plane.  Not only will sanding fill the pores with sanding dust, the wood fibers get crushed and cause fuzzy nubs under some finishes. 

Second - never use a tack cloth.  At least never use a commercial tack cloth.  Use a cloth soaked in the solvent of your finish.  That way your cloth doesn't leave anything behind that isn't incompatible with the finish.

 

Third - if you must sand, don't over sand.  Use a sanding block so your pressure is even and you don't round over edges.  I never go higher than 400 grit on solid wood.  Flatten the finish, not the wood.

 

Dust free work area is a must.  Make a finishing booth out of cardboard on at least three sides and a top.  Put a box fan into the back wall of the booth and strap a furnace filter on the intake side.  Blow the air out the back.  The idea is to keep air moving, pulling any dust in the air away from your project.

 

Finally - old finishes can't be saved.  Don't save them.  Recycle or dispose of them in a legal and environmentally safe way.  I've never used the finishes you mention in your post, but I'm not sure the poly products you mention are even a third choice for most woodworkers.  Visit your local Woodcraft store to talk to them about compatible stains and top coats.  Flexner's book on understanding finishing and finishes is a great resource and should be on your self.

 

Good luck!

 

Mark

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thank you for all the tips, these have been very helpful for me

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